Uhapšen Bobi Fišer iliti demokratija na Americki nacin....

VUJANOVIĆ: Bobi Fišer ne može da dobije azil

Podgorica - Svjetska šahovska legenda Bobi Fišer neće biti stanovnik Crne Gore. Zbog stava Vlade Sjedinjenih Američkih Država on nema uslova da dobije azil - potvrdio je juče crnogorski predsjednik Filip Vujanović.
Bivšeg svjetskog prvaka u šahu Fišera, uhapšenog 16. jula u tranzitu ka Filipinima na aerodromu u Tokiju, američke vlasti traže zbog kršenja međunarodnih sankcija prema bivšoj SRJ. Iako su ga američke vlasti upozorile da će prekršiti međunarodne sankcije, Fišer je 1992. na Svetom Stefanu odigrao šahovski meč sa Borisom Spaskim.
Predsjednik Šahovskog saveza Srbije i Crne Gore Božidar Ivanović, saopštio je prije nekoliko dana da je Fišer od pet zemalja koje su mu ponudile japanske vlasti za deportaciju izabrao Crnu Goru, kao i da se u ovaj slučaj uključio i nekadašnji čelnik Svjetske šahovske federacije Florensio Klampomanes.
U međuvremenu je iz Američkog konzulata u Podgorici saopšteno da za Bobija Fišera, optuženog 1992. godine u SAD, postoji važeći nalog za hapšenje i da američki organi nadležni za sprovođenje zakona očekuju da će on biti priveden pravdi.
- Vlada SAD očekuje da Fišer bude izručen što prije. Zbog takvog očekivanja i stava američke vlade, potpuno je razumljivo da ne može dobiti azil u Crnoj Gori - rekao je crnogorski predsjednik Radiju Crne Gore.

---

Nema potrebe da se brinete, sada ce gazda Jezda i
njegova razgranata mreza mocnika da sredi stvari
sa Amerikom i eto Bobija na slobodi in no time.

---

UPDATE

Boboi Fišer dobio boravišnu vizu za Island ali je njegov zahtev za azil u toj evropskoj zemlji odbijen.
Inače Bobi Fišer je sada trenutno bez pasoša jer mu je USA pasoš istekao a nije produžen. On jos uvek čeka odluku nemačkih vlasti povodom zahteva za državljanstvo...

From Reuters:

"Fugitive chess master Bobby Fischer has been offered a new home in Iceland, where he won a classic victory in 1972, but it is unclear whether he will be able to make the move from his detention in Japan. Icelandic fans said they had persuaded Fischer, wanted by Washington for playing a 1992 match in Yugoslavia in violation of sanctions, to write to their government requesting residency. "We bent the rules to invite Fischer to Iceland because he is connected to the history of Iceland in a unique way because of the match in 1972," Illugi Gunnarsson, an aide to Foreign Minister David Oddsson, told Reuters in Reykjavik on Thursday."



I certainly remember it as one of the few times someone with an actual BRAIN got the public semi star treatment instead of grunting sports "heroes" and vapid gibbering trained parrot "actrons" and snakeoil salesmen "politicians".

more: "Icelandic chess fan Hrafn Jokulsson said Fischer "has been wanted for 12 years for playing chess in a country that no longer exists, according to laws that no one has been incriminated for before.

"We have been fighting for the solution of the problem, so that the old champion doesn't have to live in a prison camp in Japan or a U.S. prison," he said.

An official at Iceland's embassy in Tokyo said an embassy staffer would visit Fischer and give him the permit.

But the former champion may not find a safe haven there since Iceland has an extradition agreement with Washington, Iceland's immigration chief Georg Larusson told local media.

"If Fischer comes to Iceland the government would have an obligation to deport him if the U.S. government requests it," Morgunbladid newspaper reported, citing Larusson."

...more at the link. So he's not out of the woods yet, but it's a decent start, IMO. The US government is a big fat hypocrite on this issue. NOW they are allegedly fighting "islamic terrorists", but back then when this was going down when Serbia got invaded by Albanian and Bosnian "islamic terrorists",outright invaded and actually had the temerity to fight back pretty hard, supposedly it was "all their fault" so we had to go to war against them. What rubbish. And telling a US citizen where they can and cannot go goes against every single principle of our alleged born-with "freedoms". We have freedom of travel and freedom of association, I think that about covers it. And there was no legal declaration of war for any "restrictions", so that argument don't hold water either, IMO. We haven't had a legit legal war since WW2, and these various travel "restrictions" are all bogus, again, IMO.

The entire above is an editorial obviously, the raw news stands on it's own.

Komletan text pisma koje je Department of the Treasury uputilo Fiseru neposredno uoci meca....



Department of the Treasury
Washington
Aug 21, 1992

Order to Provide Information and Cease and Desist Activities

FAC No. 129405

Dear Mr. Fischer:

It has come to our attention that you are planning to play a chess match for a cash prize in the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia (Serbia and Montenegro) (hereinafter "Yugoslavia") against Boris Spassky on or about September 1, 1992. As a U.S. citizen, you are subject to the prohibitions under Executive Order 12810, dated June 5, 1992, imposing sanctions against Serbia and Montenegro. The United States Department of the Treasury, Office of Foreign Assets Control ("FAC"), is charged with enforcement of the Executive Order.

The Executive Order prohibits U.S. persons from performing any contract in support of a commercial project in Yugoslavia, as well as from exporting services to Yugoslavia. The purpose of this letter is to inform you that the performance of your agreement with a corporate sponsor in Yugoslavia to play chess is deemed to be in support of that sponsor's commercial activity. Any transactions engaged in for this purpose are outside the scope of General License No. 6, which authorizes only transactions to travel, not to business or commercial activities. In addition, we consider your presence in Yugoslavia for this purpose to be an exportation of services to Yugoslavia in the sense that the Yugoslav sponsor is benefiting from the use of your name and reputation.

Violations of the Executive Order are punishable by civil penalties not to exceed $10,000 per violation, and by criminal penalties not to exceed $250,000 per individual, 10 years in prison, or both. You are hereby directed to refrain from engaging in any of the activities described above. You are further requested to file a report with this office with 10 business days of your receipt of this letter, outlining the facts and circumstances surrounding any and all transactions relating to your scheduled chess match in Yugoslavia against Boris Spassky. The report should be addressed to: The U.S. Department of the Treasury, Office of Foreign Assets Control, Enforcement Division, 1500 Pennsylvania Avenue, N.W., Annex - 2nd floor, Washington D.C. 20220. If you have any questions regarding this matter, please contact Merete M. Evans at (202) 622-2430.

Sincerely, (signed)
R. Richard Newcomb
Director
Office of Foreign Assets Control

Mr. Bobby Fischer
c/o Hotels Stefi Stefan (Room. 118)
85 315 Stefi Stefan
Montenegro, Yugoslavia

cc:

Charles P. Pashayan, Jr., Esq.
1418 33rd St., N.W.
Washington, DC 20007

Choate & Choate
Attorneys at Law
The Pacific Mutual Building
523 West Sixth Street
Suite 541
Los Angeles, CA 90014

U.S. Embassy
Belgrade, Yugoslavia

I sada nesto sto bi trebalo da procitaju svi oni koji misle da je sve ovo protiv Fisera uradjeno legalno i na pravi nacin....eto sta je demokratija... fuj

Threatening Letter to Bobby Fischer
I am deeply thankful to a person who says that he wishes not to be identified for providing a copy of the 1992 letter from the US Treasury Department which, in effect, made Bobby Fischer an international fugitive from justice.

My initial reaction is that this letter constitutes an unconstitutional bill of attainder and, as such, constitutes a violation of Article 1, Section 9, Paragraph 3 of the Constitution of the United States.

A Bill of Attainder is defined in the law as: "A law or legal device which outlaws people, suspends their civil rights, confiscates their property, or punishes without a trial."

Generally, any act of a legislative body which targets a particular person constitutes an unconstitutional bill of attainder. This is why the United States Congress in proposing and drafting laws always tries to be careful to write laws which apply generally to all and do not single out any individual or group. The "Windfall Profits Tax" was found by the courts to be an unconstitutional bill of attainder because it exempted from the law the North Slope of Alaska.

In this case, we do not even have a law but rather have an arrogant declaration by an agency bureaucrat directed to the punishment of a person: Bobby Fischer. Bobby Fischer is ordered not to play chess with Boris Spassky. This order comes from the authority of the President of the United States.

However, the United States of America is supposedly not a dictatorship. President Bush had no legal right to order Fischer not to play chess. Bush's "Executive Order" to the extent that it applied to Fischer was plainly illegal. Therefore, sending this letter to Fischer was a crime.

Perhaps even more importantly, there was no way that the Executive Order of President Bush could be interpreted as prohibiting Fischer from playing a game of chess. The Executive Order "prohibits U.S. persons from performing any contract in support of a commercial project in Yugoslavia, as well as from exporting services to Yugoslavia."
Bobby Fischer in Argentina

Fischer did not engage in any commercial activity in Yugoslavia. Fischer did not export any services to Yugoslavia. Playing a game of chess is clearly not "exporting a service."

The United States Supreme Court long ago ruled that Americans have the constitutional right to travel. I suppose that if a person travels to Yugoslavia and orders a meal in a restaurant, he could be said to be engaging in a "commercial activity". However, if that is the definition, then this makes the constitutional right to travel a nullity.

Somebody said, "Fischer is not that important. He is not entitled to special treatment."

However, that is precisely the problem here. A great multitude of American citizens traveled to Yugoslavia during the war. Not one of them has ever been prosecuted for violating Bush's "executive order." Our own United States Chess Federation continued to buy chess books from Yugoslavia throughout the war. Yet, not one official of the United States Chess Federation is in jail for this (although that is where some of them belong, in my opinion).

One of my closest friends, Charles Weldon, a distinguished professor of Computer Science at City University of New York, went to Yugoslavia during the war. Clearly, his presence in Yugoslavia, in view of his position of one of America's most distinguished computer scientists, was a matter of more serious concern than a few games of chess played by Bobby Fischer. Yet, Weldon was never harassed by the US Government because of his presence in Yugoslavia.

Unfortunately, this had a tragic end. Weldon became ill with appendicitis, which would have been easily treatable in America. Because of the US embargo, Weldon could not get adequate treatment in Belgrade where he was and died as a result. I am told by a mutual friend, a girlfriend we once shared who became a medical doctor, that Weldon was asking about me just before he died.

I believe that the Treasury official who wrote the letter to Fischer, R. Richard Newcomb, should be criminally prosecuted for writing this letter. Making threats such as those contained in his letter which are without legal basis and which cannot be carried out is clearly a crime. Please note that Newcomb threatened Fischer with ten years in prison and a fine of $250,000. If Mr. Newcomb happens to be a lawyer, he can easily be disbarred for writing this letter.

The tragedy is that this 1992 letter made Bobby Fischer an international fugitive from justice and he has not returned to America because of this.

I must also mention that it was within this time frame that my own daughter was kidnapped in the United Arab Emirates in 1990 from my care and custody through the efforts of a State Department official named Stephen R. Pattison. The sort of arrogance of these federal government officials in writing threatening letters to Bobby Fischer and in kidnapping my 8-year-old daughter, Shamema, is exactly what is being cited by those who hole up in the mountains of Montana and Idaho and who declare themselves sovereign and independent of US authority and who blow up federal office buildings and try to kill federal officials for reasons which they feel are entirely justified.

Sam Sloan

Takodje jos jedan dokaz DEMOKRATIJE....ili HOW TO - od nacionalnog heroja do teroriste ...povraca mi se...

Ja ne vidim nista nelegalno. Zasto je nelegalno to sto su ga upozorili da ce da krsi zakon ak oigra sah u Srbiji? Nisu ga uhvatili i smestili u zatvor da ne bi mogao da igra sah.


Slobodane, ja ne vidim gde su njega u tekstu proglasili za teroristu? Ne znam sto izmisljas tako. I ne znam sto ti se povraca? Je l' zato sto je Fiser podrzavao terorizam ili zbog toga sto su ga izbacili iz americke sahovske asocijacije? Pa ja ne znam stvarno sta je gore i zbog cega bi prvo trebalo povracati.

I ja se slazem sa Srkijem - Stellanova, mozes li malo da elaboriras sta su oni to nelegalno uradili i sta je po tebi tu nedemokratski? I, da, gde je to Bobi proglasen za teroristu :)

Oko onih akrobacijica i poredjenja sa ruckom u restoranu - samo cu se nasmejati, to su tandara-mandara pricice koje mozes da pokusas pri utaji poreza (i koje nece uspeti, btw) a iza ti iza viri vila od cetvorocifrenog broja kvadrata - odbrana a la gospodin Karic za porez od 0 dinara 2001-ve godine. Dakle, sponzorisano igranje saha radi najavljene sedmocifrene dolarske nagrade je i te kako komercijalna aktivnost - pogotovu zato sto je najavljivana unapred i zato sto je gospodin bio pismeno upozoren da to ne radi - A najtragicnije je sto su to pare ukredene od gradjana Srbije preko piramidalne seme ili, u najbolju ruku, zaradjene spekulacijama na ceni nafte tokom sankcija zbog kojih su ljudi jeli pomije u to isto vreme... mislim da bi gradjani Srbije bili poslednji kojima ova odluka smeta.

Takodje, oko izbacivanja iz udruzenja - cinjenica jeste da je Bobi govorio u prilog napadima na USA - jbg, njegovo je pravo da to radi i to mu niko ne moze zabraniti - ali je onda sasvim uobicajeno ocekivati da ce jedna nacionalna organizacija te zemlje koja je napadnuta da reaguje na taj nacin - vrlo je moguce da tamo ima sahista koji su izgubili najdraze u onim zgradama.



Ne bih da se mesam u tudju nesrecu ali ovo objasnjenje mi zvuci prilicno nategnuto.

I u najgorem slucaju - Budimpesta je na 6h brze voznje - a pucanje slepog creva je hitan slucaj koji se obavezno procesira - sto se upale tice, u to vreme je za $100-$200 mogao da ima najbolji tretman u Srbiji (sankcije, plata par dolara) a tesko da to nije imao u dzepu.

---

nedemokratski je to sto je on izrazavao svoje misljenje, znaci samo je javno govorio da podrzava akcije protiv Amerike, ako je zbog toga izbecen to je jednostavno nedemokratski i cista je diskriminacija!



Da li US Chess Federation ima pravo da se mesa u politicke stavove svojih clanova i da zbog toga izbacuje jednog od najvecih umova svetskog saha? NEMA! Amerika je toliko smesna da to nije normalno, ovamo se zalazu za demokratiju a u samoj zemlji sportska asocijacija izbacuje najpoznatijeg clana zbog politickih stavova....






To sto sam rekao da su ga proglasili za teroristu je samo u preneseno znacenju....zna se da su tako i mislili...po drugom osnovu i nemaju zasto da ga izbace. Da li cu ga mnozda izbacili zbog toga su je javno izneo svoje misljenje??

Ne znam koja demokratija ce da tolerise podrzavanje teroristickih akcija.



Gde pise da nemaju pravo?

---

NIgde nije pisalo da amrika sme da okupira Irak pa je ipak to uradila... Ne mora nesto da pise da bi bilo opste poznato i prihvaceno... Da je u Iraku neki sportista tako okarakterisan zbog podrzavanja US okupatorske vlasti svi bi reagovali u fazonu kako to nije demokratski...
I jos jednom US Chess Federation je udruzenje sahista, sah je sport, nije politika, on je tamo zbog saha a ne zbog necega drugog...

Kakve veze ima podrzavanje teroristickih akcija sa demokratijom? Ako jedna javna licnost JAVNO podrzava teroristicke akcije protiv svoje zemlje, ne da ga treba izbaciti iz sportske asocijacije, vec mu treba oduzeti pasos, drzavljanstvo i zabraniti ulazak u zemlju, pa neka ide u Avganistan i neka odande podrzava teroristicke akcije i oseti pravu demokratiju. Ovo nema blage veze sa demokratijom.

---

A kakve sport ima veze sa teroristima?

HINT: Sportista podrzava teroristicke akcije

---

Ne, on nikada javno nije rekao da podrzava teroristicke akcije, samo je govorio da bi mu je drago sto se to desilo a da ce valjda sada US Gov. shvatiti da ne moze da bude svetski policajac...

?????

---

Rekao sam sledece,

ON je javno podrzavao akcije protiv Amerike, tako sto je rekao da se nada da ce ih to osvestiti malo iz tog njihovog sna i iluzije da mogu da rade sta hoce... Nikada on javno nije rekao da podrzava ove ili one...nikoga on javno nikada nije poimence podrzavao...

Rekao je da su teroristicki napadi carobna vest i da je srecan zbog toga i rekao je da pozdravlja te napade. Ako to nije podrska pa ja onda ne znam sta je. Takodje tada je rekao i da Ameriku treba unistiti.
Takodje izgleda da ne znas sta je demokratija. Niko ne kaze da u demokratiji neko ne moze da krsi zakon. Bobi Fiser lepo moze da tuzi drzavu sudu ako smatra da je njegovim izbacivanjem iz americke sahovske federacije prekrsen neki zakon.
Po tebi ispada da u demokratiji ne moze niko da bude korumpiran pa da uhapsi nekoga bez razloga ili radi nesto ilegalno? To uopste nema veze sa demokratijom jer to ne zavisi od demokratije. Ako ti mozes da tuzis drzavu i trazis odstetu onda ne vidim tu nista nedemokratsko.

Takodje otkud ti to da oni nemaju pravo da ga izbace? Da li si uopste pogledao statute i pravilnik organizacije. Hint: Article III : Section 12 - Revocation of Membership. Ostavicu tebi da potrazis sam taj dokument, ako ga ne mozes naci ostavicu ti direktan link. Tu izmedju ostalog pise:

E onda treba da pogledas i USCF Code of Ethics. Ne znam kako mozes da tvrdis da oni nemaju prava da ga izbace a da uopste nisi pogledao pravilnik federacije.

Stellanova, uopste te ne razumem. Covek pozdravlja teroristicke napade a tebi se povraca zbog toga sto ga izbacuju iz USCF? Pa valjda bi prvo trebalo da ti se povraca zbog toga sto pozdravlja teroristicke napade.

Takodje pogledaj u pravilniku i Section 13. Revocation of Membership or Affiliation.


Pa pogledaj ponovo optuznicu, bili su linkovi u ovoj temi. U optuznici nema nista o krsenju tog "naredjenja" nego ga tuze samo zbog krsenja zakona. Takodje ako on smatra da je neko iz drzavne administracije prekrsio zakon i ustav tim pismom onda moze da tuzi drzavu. Ne razumem kako mislis da demokratija spreci nekoga da krsi zakon. Pa demokratija ne menja svest i savest ljudi. Ja licno ne mislim da je prekrsen zakon ali ako ti mislis da jeste to opet nema veze sa demokratijom. Uvek postoje sudovi. Molio bih te da ne skrecemo toliko u politiku i raspravu o demokratiji i ostalim drzavnim uredjenjima nego da pricamo o konkretnom slucaju.


Nego sta je? Pa nije on igrao sah bez kamera i medijske paznje. Njegova usluga je bilo da dozvoli snimanje njega dok igra sah da bi drugi od medija zaradili pare za prenos a mediji zaradili pare od reklama i da bi neki placali drzavi porez. Ako gledas tako onda ispada da ni glumci ni sportisti ne treba da placaju porez jer ne vrse promet ni robe ni usluga. To sto se sportisti i glumci pojavljuju pred kamerama jeste promet usluga jer televizija od toga zaradjuje pare. Takodje su se placale i karte za gledanje sahovskog meca. U svakom slucaju cak i da nisam u pravu oni nece Bobija Fisera osuditi bez sudjenja. Ako on smatra da to nije pruzanje usluga neka se tako brani na sudu. Ne znam u cemu je problem. Da li smatras da u demokratiji neko ne moze da bude nevino optuzen i da niko optuzen ne bi trebalo da moze da se odbrani na sudu?